New to the board, so apologies if this topic has already come up (I couldn't find it anywhere in the archives), but...
where do you think Machado ranks in terms of all-time Iona greats? I'm talking about "original" Iona players, so transfers (e.g. Glover, Momo, etc.) wouldn't count, although players who left early (Ruland) would be considered.
I'm sure how he finishes this year (and how the team finishes) will have a lot to do with where we rank him, but would be curious to hear everyone's take based on where he's at right now.
No matter what way you spin it, I have to imagine that he's Top 10 all-time right now?
Scott is probably in the top 10 or close to it. Guys I would definitely rank ahead of him would be:
Jeff Ruland Richie Guerrin Warren Issaac Steve Burtt, Sr.
Gaels in the same range as Scott (in no particular order) would be:
Steve Burtt, Jr. Rory Grimes Tony Hargraves Tariq Kirksay Kevin Hamilton Gary Springer, Sr. Mindaugas Timinskas Kashif Hameed Dave Brown Glen Vickers Kevin Bass
I'm sure I forgot some others.
I think what happens the rest of the way will affect his legacy a great deal. If he leads the nation in assists and the Gaels to the Sweet 16, he will probably move into the top 5. If he fades a bit and Iona misses the NCAA's, he'd be more in the 10 to 15 range.
New to the board, so apologies if this topic has already come up (I couldn't find it anywhere in the archives), but...
where do you think Machado ranks in terms of all-time Iona greats? I'm talking about "original" Iona players, so transfers (e.g. Glover, Momo, etc.) wouldn't count, although players who left early (Ruland) would be considered.
I'm sure how he finishes this year (and how the team finishes) will have a lot to do with where we rank him, but would be curious to hear everyone's take based on where he's at right now.
No matter what way you spin it, I have to imagine that he's Top 10 all-time right now?
Iona05 welcome to the board. I think Scott is a possible top ten player; but his story is incomplete. His ranking IMO, would sure be bolstered w/ an NCAA appearance. As for excluding transfers I don't know if I agree with that premise, if Glover doesn't transfer here I don't believe we're having this discussion about Machado!
Scott is probably in the top 10 or close to it. Guys I would definitely rank ahead of him would be:
Jeff Ruland Richie Guerrin Warren Issaac Steve Burtt, Sr.
Gaels in the same range as Scott (in no particular order) would be:
Steve Burtt, Jr. Rory Grimes Tony Hargraves Tariq Kirksay Kevin Hamilton Gary Springer, Sr. Mindaugas Timinskas Kashif Hameed Dave Brown Glen Vickers Kevin Bass
I'm sure I forgot some others.
I think what happens the rest of the way will affect his legacy a great deal. If he leads the nation in assists and the Gaels to the Sweet 16, he will probably move into the top 5. If he fades a bit and Iona misses the NCAA's, he'd be more in the 10 to 15 range.
Gaelman strong list, one of my additions would be Ricky Soliver
Gaelman, I too like your list but find it hard to compare Scott to non-PGs. Limiting the list to PGs, I put Scott neck and neck with Rory Grimes. If Scott sinks a late FT to win a NCAA game, he get the nod.
Last Edit: Jan 5, 2012 12:54:28 GMT -5 by epatrick
For one year, and EP is correct, we should only compare Scott to other point guards. He's on his way to having the greatest PG half year in Iona history. Rory and John McDonald did it for an entire year winning MAAC championships in the process. In fact Rory did it for a career, and imo was a better scorer than Scott, though I think that Scott is a better passer. JMO.
Scott is probably in the top 10 or close to it. Guys I would definitely rank ahead of him would be:
Jeff Ruland Richie Guerrin Warren Issaac Steve Burtt, Sr.
Gaels in the same range as Scott (in no particular order) would be:
Steve Burtt, Jr. Rory Grimes Tony Hargraves Tariq Kirksay Kevin Hamilton Gary Springer, Sr. Mindaugas Timinskas Kashif Hameed Dave Brown Glen Vickers Kevin Bass
I'm sure I forgot some others.
I think what happens the rest of the way will affect his legacy a great deal. If he leads the nation in assists and the Gaels to the Sweet 16, he will probably move into the top 5. If he fades a bit and Iona misses the NCAA's, he'd be more in the 10 to 15 range.
Gaelman strong list, one of my additions would be Ricky Soliver
I considered Soliver, but felt he was a bit too inconsistent (until his Senior year) to make the list.
My compliments Gaelman on your list. I am still leaning towards Rory Grimes over Scott as best PG but.... we will see after this year. Nakeia Miller is a borderline candidate over Dave Brown who was one of Jimmy V's first recruits.
Post by hawaii bill on Jan 5, 2012 12:35:49 GMT -5
Purely, based on overall skills in aggregate - passing, shooting, decision making, ability to handle pressure D, I'd rank Grimes just ahead of Machado. But I believe Scott makes those two FT's at the end of the Va. game.
My compliments Gaelman on your list. I am still leaning towards Rory Grimes over Scott as best PG but.... we will see after this year. Nakeia Miller is a borderline candidate over Dave Brown who was one of Jimmy V's first recruits.
I thought about Miller too. Like Soliver, I thought he was a bit less consistent than some of the others on the list. I never saw Brown play.
Grimes vs. Machado is very close and a tough call. Grimes was surrounded by a lot of guys who could create their own shots (Burtt, Hargraves, Springer) which made his job a little easier, but probably also kept his assist totals down a bit. (He averaged less than 5.)
Grimes was amazing against pressure defense. He used to shred opponents presses all by himself. He was a slightly better outside shooter than Machado, but didn't take all that many until his senior year, after Burtt and Springer graduated.
Perhaps his greatest shot was one he missed. In the first MAAC final, with Iona down by 2, SPC missed a free throw with 5 seconds left and Grimes took it the length of the floor, but missed the layup...then the late Troy Truesdale came out of nowhere to slam home the rebound to send the game to OT, which the Gaels dominated.
The other thing I remember most about Grimes was him playing ALL 65 minutes in the 5 OT win over Fairfield.
I think Machado is a better playmaker and penatrator and controls the game more. They are pretty much equal as scorers.
As many have stated, Machado's place in Iona history will be largely determined by how he finishes the season what the Gaels do in the post season. Point guards are judged largely by team success. If the Gaels make it to the NCAA's and win a game or two, he might go down as Iona's greatest PG.
Scott is probably in the top 10 or close to it. Guys I would definitely rank ahead of him would be:
Jeff Ruland Richie Guerrin Warren Issaac Steve Burtt, Sr.
Gaels in the same range as Scott (in no particular order) would be:
Steve Burtt, Jr. Rory Grimes Tony Hargraves Tariq Kirksay Kevin Hamilton Gary Springer, Sr. Mindaugas Timinskas Kashif Hameed Dave Brown Glen Vickers Kevin Bass
I'm sure I forgot some others.
I think what happens the rest of the way will affect his legacy a great deal. If he leads the nation in assists and the Gaels to the Sweet 16, he will probably move into the top 5. If he fades a bit and Iona misses the NCAA's, he'd be more in the 10 to 15 range.
if we're counting transfers on this list, then i think you have to put sean green on the Top 10, if not Top 5. the guy averaged around 20 PPG and 5 RPG in his Iona career, and was an NBA draft pick.
Scott is probably in the top 10 or close to it. Guys I would definitely rank ahead of him would be:
Jeff Ruland Richie Guerrin Warren Issaac Steve Burtt, Sr.
Gaels in the same range as Scott (in no particular order) would be:
Steve Burtt, Jr. Rory Grimes Tony Hargraves Tariq Kirksay Kevin Hamilton Gary Springer, Sr. Mindaugas Timinskas Kashif Hameed Dave Brown Glen Vickers Kevin Bass
I'm sure I forgot some others.
I think what happens the rest of the way will affect his legacy a great deal. If he leads the nation in assists and the Gaels to the Sweet 16, he will probably move into the top 5. If he fades a bit and Iona misses the NCAA's, he'd be more in the 10 to 15 range.
Gaelman, I would have Mikkel Larsen on the list.
I considered him as well, and I think you are right. He was 2 time first team All-MAAC and made the 2nd Team as a senior. I think Ruland messed him up a little trying to turn him from a great finesse player into a bruiser. The idea of toughening him up was sound, but it just didn't quite work out.
If we include transfers (as someone suggested), I'd add
Mike Glover Sean Green John McDonald Bryan Matthew (one of my all-time favorites and maybe the most underrated Gael ever).
I considered him as well, and I think you are right. He was 2 time first team All-MAAC and made the 2nd Team as a senior. I think Ruland messed him up a little trying to turn him from a great finesse player into a bruiser. The idea of toughening him up was sound, but it just didn't quite work out.
If we include transfers (as someone suggested), I'd add
Mike Glover Sean Green John McDonald Bryan Matthew (one of my all-time favorites and maybe the most underrated Gael ever).
All good calls Gaelman, although I think you have to weigh transfers on the list based on how long they were Gales for. For instance, Sean Green, who put in three extremely productive seasons (one of which was legendary), should probably be ranked higher on the list than a transfer who put in 1-2 great seasons, a la McDonald or Glover.
Great call on Matthew, by the way. Loved him as a Gael.
If I was back in my old neighborhood playground choosing sides in a pickup game. . . it would be a difficult choice between Rory Grimes and Scott Machado as to who would be my first choice as my floor general. . .however if I couldn’t get either one I wouldn’t be too disappointed with Ricky Soliver who was a terrific all-around player.
And as for Bigs. . .you would have to go first with Big Jeff the player (not the coach!). However my next choice would be Michael Glover as no one has quicker reflexes on a basketball court. You have to like Golver’s ability on jump balls and I’m looking forward to seeing him dominate the rest of the way this season.
